Breeding Plans

[YellowBelly]

Do people have breeding plans that involve selective breeding kind of like creating pedigrees i.e. to increase the size or pronounce a colour? Or is breeding totally randomised in the hobby?

[Ian]

I realise this thread is a little old. However I'm not aware of anyone selectively breeding specimens.

However, it would be nice to see some cultures of purely green Extatosoma, or yellow Heteropteryx.

[Daniel Ballmer]

Thought I'd answered to this post some months ago... Was there a similar one?

However I wouldn't recommend selection in stocks of E. tiaratum because they have massive inbreeding problems and selection would just make everything worse.

[Ian]

Oh I hadn't heard of that, would certainly not be a good idea then.

Is the colouring more of a genetic factor, or a biotic factor?

[Daniel Ballmer]

We once thought it was more genetic, but a friend lately kept some nymphs in an enclosure with lichen and they turned out lichen-coloured. So now we know it's probably more biotic.

[Ian]

Hmm, interesting. I know with mantids it's certainly biotic, but colour change seems to be a lot more subtle with phasmids.

[TheGreenMan]

My green ETs all turn green on my garden when feeding on Muntingia tree but a friend who i gave some to fed them on guava and got a very diverse range of colours from dark red/brown to green and all colours in between. I suppose it would be possible to isolate a particular colour type with careful breeding but you may lose genetic variation and produce inbreeding problems.

For some reason mine all turn bright green during the final moults on the Muntingia tree but on guava they show the full range of colours in adulthood. I had nymphs of various colours but they all turned green in the later stages.

[Luna]

That's interesting, according to Daniel's post the colour of the ET would seem to depend on its surroundings (surely it wouldn't eat the lichen?) as opposed to the effects if its foodsource. Or maybe both play a part? Perhaps when I rear my next generation I will seperate them and test one lot on Eucalyptus, one lot on Oak with an environment full of lichen-covered wood and another on bramble.

Also, could some forms of Lichen be dangerous to ETs? And if so, what types would be wise to avoid?

[Yom-Kippur]

The matter with my medauroidea extradentata is opposite. My stock is evergreen, even if I used to try to keep them on dark surface. But on web placed mostly brown colored ME. My colony is full partenogenetic, that is why I think there is no any genetic changes and no any color variants. I'd prefer to think both conditions are important - genetic and environment.

[Carim]

yh i have been wondering about this for ages,
i think it is probably due to both genetics and environment (which is Abiotic, not biotic btw :rolleyes:)
i would really like to try that lichen experiment with my new Et hatchlings, although i havent really got access to that white/blueish lichen :(

its really interesting though that these species are even capable of adapting to their surroundings, it must mean that somewhere inside them is some sort of "bank" of different looks they can take on, and how do they adapt to lichen, because unlike when they turn green on various diets, they arent eating the lichen, so is it just what main colours they see around them?...

[stickinsect123]

how does this guy get such a good range of colouration? at first I thought he had spray painted them but the colouration is real
http://www.flickr.com/photos/38518908@N06/3585663268/

[Daniel Ballmer]

We seem to mix the themes a bit... Let's talk about ETs only because the other species can have totally other reasons for their colour variations.

@ Luna: I'm sure no lichen is dangerous to phasmids. All sorts of lichen grow so slow that there are very few insects feeding on them. They don't have to produce insecticides. And even if they do, it won't harm ETs because they don't eat it.

@ Dmitriy: There are some green stocks of M. extradentata, they are all parthenogenetic. In the brown stocks, there can be some green individuals sometimes.

@ stickinsect: These are mostly wild caught Phyllium, I think. Red and yellow individuals are not rare in the wild, but they are in culture. The german insect seller "Insektenkönig" sells wild caught Phyllium bioculatum in red and yellow for horrible prices and the following generations are 95% green.

[Luna]

how does this guy get such a good range of colouration? at first I thought he had spray painted them but the colouration is real
http://www.flickr.com/photos/38518908@N06/3585663268/

Some of those almost look like they have been fed leaves which have been kept in pots of water with red-dye.

I'm very supprised to hear that such a shocking red/purple colour is a natural thing.